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lennart
07-10-03, 17:04
The case against Jordan
By ALAN M. DERSHOWITZ

Jordan is the West's favorite Arab nation. And for good reason, since it is the best of a generally bad lot. Most westerners admired King Hussein, adore his best-selling widow Queen Noor, and respect his son, King Abdullah. US President George W. Bush recently, and appropriately, praised King Abdullah for his devotion to peace in the region. No one has to write "The Case for Jordan," as I have had to write The Case for Israel.

But any fair comparison between the Middle East's most reviled and condemned nation, Israel, and its most praised nation, Jordan, starkly reveals the invidious double standard applied to Israel.

A few largely unknown facts about Jordan:

Jordan has a law on its books explicitly prohibiting any Jew from becoming a citizen, or any Jordanian from selling land to a Jew. It has refused to amend this law despite repeated demands.

Jordan has perfected the art of torture and uses it routinely against dissidents, suspected terrorists and perceived opponents of the monarchy. I'm talking about real torture here, not the kind of rough interrogation occasionally employed by the US and Israel. Jordan even threatens to torture and tortures the entirely innocent relatives of suspected terrorists, as it did with Abu Nidal's mother.

The United States is fully aware of Jordan's proficiency in torture, having "subcontracted" some of its own difficult cases to Jordanian "experts" (along with Egyptian and Philippine torture experts). Yet the UN has never condemned Jordan for its use of torture.

Jordan killed more Palestinians in one month September 1970, known as Black September than Israel has killed during the three years of suicide bombings that began in the fall of 2000. The brutality of the Jordanian Army toward Palestinian dissidents and terrorists was far more egregious than anything Israel has ever done.

The Jordanian Army has deliberately bombed civilian areas of Israeli cities in clear violation of international law. In 1967, before Israel fired a single shot at Jordan, the Jordanian Army fired 1,600 missiles into west Jerusalem, targeting apartment buildings, shops and other non-military targets. Israel did not respond by bombing Amman, which it easily could have done. It responded by attacking Jordanian military targets and then offering a cease-fire, which Jordan rejected.
JORDAN IS not a democracy. It is a hereditary monarchy which stifles dissent, freedom of speech and freedom of the press. Its democratic facades a legislature, cabinet, judiciary are all subject to control by the Hashemite minority rulers who were placed in charge of the majority Palestinian population by a colonial decision.

Why do Americans not know the case against Jordan? Because it is in no one's interest to make it. Jordan is an ally of the United States (at least some of the time). It is a peace partner with Israel (at least now). It is the best of the Arab states in the Middle East, but "best" is a comparative term with a relatively low basis for comparison.

Why then am I making the case against Jordan? Simply to demonstrate the double standard so widely employed in judging Israel. Nothing justifies this double standard. Yes, Israel receives American aid, but so does Jordan (as well as Egypt, the Palestinian Authority and other Arab states). Indeed Jordan receives, on a per capita basis, more actual aid than Israel, if aid is defined as receiving assistance in return for nothing. Israel earns its aid by giving back an enormous amount especially in the area of military intelligence and technology. The aid given to Jordan is entirely a one-way street that goes primarily into propping up its minority monarchy and preventing its Palestinian majority from taking over. Israel, as a democracy, needs no aid to prevent internal upheaval.

So this case against Jordan is really part of the case for Israel. It invites fair-minded people to ask why Jordan which by any standard of fair judgment is less democratic, more oppressive, and far more racist gets a pass while Israel is subject to so much vilification.

Having made the case against Jordan, let me add that I, too, admired King Hussein, whom I had the pleasure of meeting. I, too, respect his son King Abdullah, who recently met with Bush and restated his commitment to a peaceful two-state solution. But I must insist and the world must insist on a single standard of judgment and criticism with regard to all nations. By any such standard, Israel deserves less criticism and more praise than Jordan.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1065455551092

Ik moest zo lachen toen ik dit zag. Tunnelvisie zullen we maar zeggen.

Die Dershowitz is overigens een PROFESSOR aan de Harvard Universiteit, die het onlangs nog voor elkaar kreeg om in zijn boek "The Case For Israel" te schrijven dat er tijdens de Naqba slechts 2,000 - 3,000 Palestijnse vluchtelingen waren. Zijn boek was overigens grotendeels plagiaat, gekopieerd van een andere geschiedenisvervalser, Joan Peters. Ondanks duidelijke plagiaat dat op elke normale universiteit zou leiden tot ontslag, mag hij nog steeds zijn moslimhaat spuwen.

Waarom vond ik dit stuk zo komisch:

The Case against Jordan :



Jordan has a law on its books explicitly prohibiting any Jew from becoming a citizen, or any Jordanian from selling land to a Jew. It has refused to amend this law despite repeated demands.


In Israel mogen niet-Joden geen burger worden, en mag land niet aan niet-Joden worden verkocht



Jordan has perfected the art of torture and uses it routinely against dissidents, suspected terrorists and perceived opponents of the monarchy.


Israel maakt ook gebruik van systematische martelingen, volgens VN en HRW raporten, maar wordt gebagataliseerd door Dershowitz



The Jordanian Army has deliberately bombed civilian areas of Israeli cities in clear violation of international law.


Doet Israel ook, zij noemen het "targetting" killing.

:maf2:

Die Dershowitz maakt de Israelische zaak belachelijk.

Kachol Levan
08-10-03, 08:48
Geplaatst door lennart
The case against Jordan
By ALAN M. DERSHOWITZ

Jordan is the West's favorite Arab nation. And for good reason, since it is the best of a generally bad lot. Most westerners admired King Hussein, adore his best-selling widow Queen Noor, and respect his son, King Abdullah. US President George W. Bush recently, and appropriately, praised King Abdullah for his devotion to peace in the region. No one has to write "The Case for Jordan," as I have had to write The Case for Israel.

But any fair comparison between the Middle East's most reviled and condemned nation, Israel, and its most praised nation, Jordan, starkly reveals the invidious double standard applied to Israel.

A few largely unknown facts about Jordan:

Jordan has a law on its books explicitly prohibiting any Jew from becoming a citizen, or any Jordanian from selling land to a Jew. It has refused to amend this law despite repeated demands.

Jordan has perfected the art of torture and uses it routinely against dissidents, suspected terrorists and perceived opponents of the monarchy. I'm talking about real torture here, not the kind of rough interrogation occasionally employed by the US and Israel. Jordan even threatens to torture and tortures the entirely innocent relatives of suspected terrorists, as it did with Abu Nidal's mother.

The United States is fully aware of Jordan's proficiency in torture, having "subcontracted" some of its own difficult cases to Jordanian "experts" (along with Egyptian and Philippine torture experts). Yet the UN has never condemned Jordan for its use of torture.

Jordan killed more Palestinians in one month September 1970, known as Black September than Israel has killed during the three years of suicide bombings that began in the fall of 2000. The brutality of the Jordanian Army toward Palestinian dissidents and terrorists was far more egregious than anything Israel has ever done.

The Jordanian Army has deliberately bombed civilian areas of Israeli cities in clear violation of international law. In 1967, before Israel fired a single shot at Jordan, the Jordanian Army fired 1,600 missiles into west Jerusalem, targeting apartment buildings, shops and other non-military targets. Israel did not respond by bombing Amman, which it easily could have done. It responded by attacking Jordanian military targets and then offering a cease-fire, which Jordan rejected.
JORDAN IS not a democracy. It is a hereditary monarchy which stifles dissent, freedom of speech and freedom of the press. Its democratic facades a legislature, cabinet, judiciary are all subject to control by the Hashemite minority rulers who were placed in charge of the majority Palestinian population by a colonial decision.

Why do Americans not know the case against Jordan? Because it is in no one's interest to make it. Jordan is an ally of the United States (at least some of the time). It is a peace partner with Israel (at least now). It is the best of the Arab states in the Middle East, but "best" is a comparative term with a relatively low basis for comparison.

Why then am I making the case against Jordan? Simply to demonstrate the double standard so widely employed in judging Israel. Nothing justifies this double standard. Yes, Israel receives American aid, but so does Jordan (as well as Egypt, the Palestinian Authority and other Arab states). Indeed Jordan receives, on a per capita basis, more actual aid than Israel, if aid is defined as receiving assistance in return for nothing. Israel earns its aid by giving back an enormous amount especially in the area of military intelligence and technology. The aid given to Jordan is entirely a one-way street that goes primarily into propping up its minority monarchy and preventing its Palestinian majority from taking over. Israel, as a democracy, needs no aid to prevent internal upheaval.

So this case against Jordan is really part of the case for Israel. It invites fair-minded people to ask why Jordan which by any standard of fair judgment is less democratic, more oppressive, and far more racist gets a pass while Israel is subject to so much vilification.

Having made the case against Jordan, let me add that I, too, admired King Hussein, whom I had the pleasure of meeting. I, too, respect his son King Abdullah, who recently met with Bush and restated his commitment to a peaceful two-state solution. But I must insist and the world must insist on a single standard of judgment and criticism with regard to all nations. By any such standard, Israel deserves less criticism and more praise than Jordan.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1065455551092

Ik moest zo lachen toen ik dit zag. Tunnelvisie zullen we maar zeggen.

Die Dershowitz is overigens een PROFESSOR aan de Harvard Universiteit, die het onlangs nog voor elkaar kreeg om in zijn boek "The Case For Israel" te schrijven dat er tijdens de Naqba slechts 2,000 - 3,000 Palestijnse vluchtelingen waren. Zijn boek was overigens grotendeels plagiaat, gekopieerd van een andere geschiedenisvervalser, Joan Peters. Ondanks duidelijke plagiaat dat op elke normale universiteit zou leiden tot ontslag, mag hij nog steeds zijn moslimhaat spuwen.

Waarom vond ik dit stuk zo komisch:

The Case against Jordan :



In Israel mogen niet-Joden geen burger worden, en mag land niet aan niet-Joden worden verkocht



Israel maakt ook gebruik van systematische martelingen, volgens VN en HRW raporten, maar wordt gebagataliseerd door Dershowitz



Doet Israel ook, zij noemen het "targetting" killing.

:maf2:

Die Dershowitz maakt de Israelische zaak belachelijk.

Als je zijn boek gelezen had, had je geweten dat voor al die dingen ook een antwoord is.

De regeling die het voor niet-joden moeilijk maakte land te kopen is door het Israelischgerechtshof onwettelijk verklaard en sinds 2001 mag iedereen waar dan ook in Israel land kopen. Dit in tegenstelling tot de PA die de doodstraf heeft staan op het verkopen van land aan Joden, en Jordanie dat Joden verbied in Jordanie te wonen, laat staan land te kopen. Jordanie is Judenrein, en als het aan Arafat lag was ook de PA Judenrein.

Israel heeft sinds 2001 ook een nieuwe wet, ingesteld door het hooggerechtshof die martelingen en fysieke druk verbieden zelfs in gevallen van leven en dood. Je moet wel bij de les blijven.

Jordanie bombardeerde complete steden om de bevolking te raken, Israel bombardeerd huizen of auto's om terroristen te raken. Niet hetzelfde.

Enne, wat over de zwarte september in 1970? Daar heb je er maar voor gekozen om er niet op te reageren.

hanskamp
08-10-03, 10:11
Helaas worden geneste quotes op dit forum niet weergegeven (of ik weet niet hoe ik dat moet instellen) i.t.t. Joods.nl, het forum waar ik ook af en toe kom.


Geplaatst door Kachol Levan
Israel heeft sinds 2001 ook een nieuwe wet, ingesteld door het hooggerechtshof die martelingen en fysieke druk verbieden zelfs in gevallen van leven en dood. Je moet wel bij de les blijven.
Ik zal dit niet bestrijden, maar Palestijnen worden nog steeds gemarteld door Israël. Israël neemt het dus niet nauw met de mensenrechten, of in elk geval niet met de beslissing van dat Hooggerechtshof, aan wiens macht ik twijfel.


Jordanie bombardeerde complete steden om de bevolking te raken, Israel bombardeerd huizen of auto's om terroristen te raken. Niet hetzelfde.
Ik ben tegen dat soort bombardementen.


Enne, wat over de zwarte september in 1970? Daar heb je er maar voor gekozen om er niet op te reageren.

Ik wil trouwens wel meer weten over de Zwarte September van 1970.

Hans Kamp.

lennart
08-10-03, 15:25
De regeling die het voor niet-joden moeilijk maakte land te kopen is door het Israelischgerechtshof onwettelijk verklaard en sinds 2001 mag iedereen waar dan ook in Israel land kopen.


Leugentje om best wil ongetwijfeld. Maar dan moet je me toch eens uitleggen waarom Arabieren in jouw land geen toestemming krijgen om nieuwe huizen te bouwen.